Religious parents getting offended Options

[shiaru]

((From my point of view gays are a blessing to society nowadays, They can't reproduce thus we have less humans being born, and that is great, we are overpopulated as it is. However if we plummet to less than one billion humans strict laws have to pass against homosexuality, but i doubt we will ever face that problem.))

[Xemnas]

That's retarded, banning homosexuals wouldn't raise the population, you'd just keep them from having sex with people that they want to.
It's discrimination, you aren't stopping men and women from having sex now, and the population is far to big.
It wouldn't work, you can't legislate desires like these, you aren't going to stamp out homosexuality.

This post has been edited by Xemnas: Sep 12 2009, 10:18 AM

[shiaru]

((Is not stamping out homosexuality besides you are taking what i said out of context, i said laws against it but i never said what those laws would be, If we ever e faced with less than 1 billion humans homosexuals should still participate in impregnation, for the benefit of humankind.))

((Possible law would be that they can continue they homosexuality as long as they have contributed to increasing human population.))

[Xemnas]

If it still isn't illegal then you aren't really making a law out of it.
You are never going to be able to force people to become breeding machines in a free society.
And a billion people seems about right for the population, we aren't going to be able to keep growing as we are unless the discoveries and dedications that we make in the next century or so are really remarkable.

And if they don't then we arrest them, yeah!

[saint bobby]

I love how far this topic has gone.

[Smoenator]

I agree. Simply mention God, and start a 34 page flame war.

[Meriquia]

Ever heard of Thomas Robert Malthus? According to his theory the reason there's so much crime and poverty and famine is because the population will always increase faster than the food supply.

He says that the world could comfortably handle and take care of the entire human race, and possibly even become a Utopian world if the population was under half a billion.

So.. no need to make gay people have babies! lol

On another note, if the population falls too low there's in vitro fertilization, so round up some volunteers of men willing to donate sperm and women willing to repopulate the world and go from there. Gay people can adopt. No one's sexuality would be compromised and everyone wins.

[Xemnas]

Well there's more than just food that causes the problems.
The food will if we keep being irresponsible, I want significant reductions in child support after the 2nd child, I don't want the government to encourage something that is already out of control.

He's deluded if he thinks solving famine will make us a Utopia, we already have plenty of food in the western world, and we aren't doing great.

Shiaru is proposing that we force people to have babies or we force them not to be gay, there's few things that I can think of that are more discriminatory or violate any type of decency. Shiaru is basically like the UN.

There we go. Though gay people still often want to give sperm or carry a baby themselves, they can't make the baby between them but it's pretty much a half way adoption.

[Omerta]

Actually,
Gays can have babies - due to Stem Cell research.
In fact, they will be able to, according to scientists, in at most(some say 2-4 if I remember correctly) 10 years time.

http://www.chromosomechronicles.com/2009/0...me-sex-couples/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2005/nov...netics.research

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-...stem-cells.html

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,...1909164,00.html

http://www.christianpost.com/article/20080...ren/index.html#

This post has been edited by Omerta: Nov 2 2009, 04:38 PM

[Meriquia]

Well there's more than just food that causes the problems.
The food will if we keep being irresponsible, I want significant reductions in child support after the 2nd child, I don't want the government to encourage something that is already out of control.

He's deluded if he thinks solving famine will make us a Utopia, we already have plenty of food in the western world, and we aren't doing great.

Shiaru is proposing that we force people to have babies or we force them not to be gay, there's few things that I can think of that are more discriminatory or violate any type of decency. Shiaru is basically like the UN.

There we go. Though gay people still often want to give sperm or carry a baby themselves, they can't make the baby between them but it's pretty much a half way adoption.

Remember our argument about robots and how I told you to watch Sliders? Same thing applies here, it was in an episode lol. It was almost a perfect world, except there was a lottery to kill people to keep the population so small. If you get the time check it out. It's called "luck of the draw."

I don't see why Shairu would force people to have babies or not be gay, if the world was really low on population I'm sure people would be more than happy to volunteer to repopulate, if not sexually then by in vitro fertilization. In fact people probably wouldn't have to try, getting pregnant happens all the time whether you want it to or not lol

Yea, with today's technology two gay people can't have a baby together. So either two gay men impregnate a woman and take soul custody of the child, or just adopt. Or two women get some sperm or adopt then it's not really possible. But like Omerta said, it will be one day. Probably one day soon.

**Edit** Oh yea, there was also an episode of Sliders where there was some sort of virus that attacked y cells or something, anyways whatever it was made it so that men couldn't have babies. So there were only a few men who could have children. In this world in vitro fertilization wasn't invented and the men were on breeding farms forced to try to make babies with women as many times a day that they could lol

Actually,
Gays can have babies - due to Stem Cell research.
In fact, they will be able to, according to scientists, in at most(some say 2-4 if I remember correctly) 10 years time.

http://www.chromosomechronicles.com/2009/0...me-sex-couples/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2005/nov...netics.research

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-...stem-cells.html

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,...1909164,00.html

http://www.christianpost.com/article/20080...ren/index.html#

That's interesting, I knew that they created viable offspring between two female mice, but I didn't know it would be possible with sperm. Pretty soon people won't even be having sex for babies, or for all I know one day MEN will carry the baby(which would be totally awesome) haha

This post has been edited by Meriquia: Nov 2 2009, 05:44 PM

[shiaru]

((But if we can gwo our babies in little incubators then we can all be happy and then i could die knowing that the world wont die off because of lack of sex.))

((though i doubt lack of sex would kill it seeing how we are an extremely efficient species producing offspring, but seriously if we could grow babies in incubators it would be awesome. But by them we would be fighting religion extremists about the whole this is playing god deal.))

This post has been edited by shiaru: Nov 2 2009, 10:32 PM

[Meriquia]

((But if we can gwo our babies in little incubators then we can all be happy and then i could die knowing that the world wont die off because of lack of sex.))

((though i doubt lack of sex would kill it seeing how we are an extremely efficient species producing offspring, but seriously if we could grow babies in incubators it would be awesome. But by them we would be fighting religion extremists about the whole this is playing god deal.))

Believe it or not, sex aside, a lot of women pretty much believe giving birth makes them some sort of war hero. Pfft not me, give me the incubator any day! lol

People already think doctors and scientists are playing God. I mean people can have a baby pretty much implanted into them. They can grow organs from scratch. They can bring (some) people back to life. I think being able to have a baby grow outside a womb isn't so unnatural. I think having a little baby moving around inside your stomach and you can like see it's body pressed against your flesh.. now that's unnatural.. Like an alien is about to rip through or something xD

but that's just me.. lol

Lack of sex will never kill the world. Sex isn't needed to make babies anymore.

[Xemnas]

Yeah, it's like a woman bragging about growing her hair.
"Congratulations ma'am, you made a baby.
Which is something a dog can do."

Shi - It isn't like it would just be one minute there'd be no males being born or something, we aren't all intrinsically linked so unless there was something like a virus that was the cause of this then there's pretty much no chance of us dying out. And even then I wouldn't say "Well we gotta force them to give sperm", I think incentives could be given, but it doesn't mean we get to be assess because one gender is dying out.

Mer - Like from the movie Alien? XD

[Meriquia]

Yeah, it's like a woman bragging about growing her hair.
"Congratulations ma'am, you made a baby.
Which is something a dog can do."

Shi - It isn't like it would just be one minute there'd be no males being born or something, we aren't all intrinsically linked so unless there was something like a virus that was the cause of this then there's pretty much no chance of us dying out. And even then I wouldn't say "Well we gotta force them to give sperm", I think incentives could be given, but it doesn't mean we get to be assess because one gender is dying out.

Mer - Like from the movie Alien? XD

I don't know if I'd compare it to growing hair, considering its one of the most horrible experiences(in my opinion) that anyone can go through. But what I really meant was, in a world where one would have the option to choose to be able to incubate a baby in an artificial womb, as opposed to carrying it in her own body, she would rather give birth herself so she could have bragging rights. Which I think is absolutely retarded.. I'll take the incubator any day lol

And yes, like the movie alien. Go to youtube and look up a baby kicking if you haven't seen it already.. it's so disgusting.

[dado031495]

Apply it to the ideas of Heaven and Hell. God supposedly is testing us through our lives and he decides if we deserve Heaven or Hell. If every decision you will make is known to God from birth, where is the test? If God writes down on a piece of paper "Hell" when you are born, what is the chance of you getting to heaven? You can't redeem yourself. If God knows all your decisions, you are condemned from birth.

Now suppose God has you born into a poor family. (key point: God put you into this family instead of the rich one that lives up the street) Your parents were laid off from their jobs at the factory (which earned minimum wage) and you lost your house while you are ten years old. Your best option while you are a child is to be a thief or do some such illegal and immoral act to support your family. Robbery after robbery, with the occasional murder of he who stands in your way. But you have to support your family. Years go by. You can't get a job due to rumors of your crimes. No one would dare hire you. So you remain a thief, and that continues until you get caught. You get a life sentence and you die in jail. God knew this would happen from your birth and designated you for Hell. But what choice did you have?

Even pastors, heck, even the pope, if you're Catholic (I'm not) deserves hell. Man is born with a sinful nature, therefore nobody has lived or can live a perfect life without sinning. (Even thoughts like envy, greed, and lust are sins. Nobody can perfectly control their thoughts.) Also the Bible says that if you commit even one sin, you're guilty of all of them. So yes, you would have no choice in the matter.

That's the reason Jesus had to die. His death allows God to forgive our sin, and therefore we are not condemned from birth. Nobody is asked to be perfect, the most important things are, as He said, love God with all your heart, and love your neighbor as yourself. So no, God is not testing us through our lives, and not deciding if we deserve Heaven or Hell, because we all, myself included, deserve Hell. That's what grace is.


Well, there's my two-cents worth, and the fundamentals of Christianity. Sure, I can't prove my beliefs beyond a shadow of a doubt, in fact, as long as you refuse to believe, you can never be convinced of anything. And I am out.

This post has been edited by dado031495: Nov 3 2009, 11:40 PM

[Xemnas]

I don't know if I'd compare it to growing hair, considering its one of the most horrible experiences(in my opinion) that anyone can go through. But what I really meant was, in a world where one would have the option to choose to be able to incubate a baby in an artificial womb, as opposed to carrying it in her own body, she would rather give birth herself so she could have bragging rights. Which I think is absolutely retarded.. I'll take the incubator any day lol

And yes, like the movie alien. Go to youtube and look up a baby kicking if you haven't seen it already.. it's so disgusting.

I'm only comparing it in terms of that it's a natural thing, I realize that it's got to be a massive pain, even without the kicking since you largely can't do things for almost a year.
I guess some would want it growing inside them for one reason or another.

Oh...oh god

Dado - You really believe that anyone really deserves to get tortured forever and ever and ever?
(And I wouldn't really put an "even" for the pope, I can think of few who are more evil)

Why does god have to sacrifice himself, to himself, to create a loophole that he created?
And not even Hitler deserves hell, your gods a monster who chucks everyone in the pool from the get-go, and holds up a life preserver and says to only some people "Want me to drag you out?"

Some people would disagree with you about the fundamentals of christianity being that.
Refusing to believe and being skeptical of beliefs until sufficient evidence is presented are different things.
Threatening people with hell isn't going to get many converts.

[El Pablo]

I read a review of the final Pendragon book on Amazon, and it was from a Christian parent who was deeply offended about the whole Solara thing. They thought that by reading a fictional story, their kids would be brainwashed into believing the details of the story to be true.

The irony is, by teaching their kid the Bible, they did just that.

So what do you think of this? Do you think that religious folks are just making a mountain out of a molehill, just like some of them did with the "Harry Potter promotes witchcraft" protest?

I have not read the past 34 pages and am new here. Please forgive me if this has already been covered/this is dead.

Personally, I think you guys are being too judgmental against religious people. I'm Christian and I have no problem if you're an atheist, Jew, Buddhist, whatever.

As for the Solara thing, Pendragon is one of my favorite book series, and I don't see how it conflicts with religion (at least mine) in any way.

Some parents think that stuff will ruin their kids minds. Personally, mine didn't see how it would turn me into an axe murderer or serial killer or something similar, so I read it and haven't murdered anyone so I guess I'm doing alright.

Last thing: do you guys know what religion D.J is? I didn't know if Halla spelled backwards being Allah was a coincidence or not.